Something weird going on

Timberland · #1 October 5th, 2006, 10:26 AM

Hello....I am new here so i'm not sure if this is in the right spot or not. I have been growing veggies indoors for a few years and came across something kind of odd that seems to run through my plants like the plague this year. I will provide details as needed since that could take up some space and i wanted to keep it brief on my first post. Basically what happens is once the plant is approx. 3-5 weeks old the leaves (new growth mainly) begin to curl up and the leaves become thickened and stunted. They stay small and start to get crisp and die (usually after a week or two). It starts with one plant and seem to effect others gradually. I don't have any pests......although i did notice a couple little flies (1/16")....I don't think they are fungus gnats or aphids though. I am using flourecent light and miracle grow potting soil. I have not used any fertilizer but I did start them from seed without germinating them. Could it be poor rooting? curly top virus? Crappy seeds? I am totally baffled. This has happened twice (2 different gardens) this year.

Thanks for any help......

**James D.** · #2 October 5th, 2006, 04:13 PM

It is more than likely a virus, or mites. If you do have fugas gnats they would be the ones spreading the problem. i suggest getting rid of the infected plants and disinfecting the area, pots and any other tools you use.

Timberland · #3 October 9th, 2006, 11:44 AM

It seems to only effect the smaller more bushy plants. It looks as though the taller plants are immune to it. How would you go about disinfecting everything?

I did however notice real tiny (1/32") orange spider things in the soil at beginning but didn't pay any attention to it since i just bought it from Home Depot and figured anything in the soil would be ok...........is that a fair assumption? Both gardens where from the same packet of seeds. I wouldn't think a virus could spread from seed to seed, or could it?

**Rima** · #4 October 9th, 2006, 12:51 PM

You've probably got spider mites (they're SOO tiny), but webs are visible between trunks and branches or leaf axils. Try some Safer's Soap Spray after a hard water spraying (and drying first), then again a week later and the week after that - and bump up your humidity.

Timberland · #5 October 9th, 2006, 01:45 PM

The both of you have mentioned mites or fungus gnats as the problem.....which sounds legit to me but i still wonder why the taller plants don't seem to be infected? Also, all these plants are indoors (in my home) and not in a greenhouse so I don't know where all these pests could come from. All the plants were potted from the same bag of soil and the plants that do get infected will be fine until they are about 4-5 weeks old. I had plants in different stages together and just as an example, say i had a plant that was about 4 weeks old it would begin to look sick but the others that were 2-3 weeks old would be ok, only until they reached that 4-5 week old milestone and then it would happen to that plant . Why does it only seem to affect plants once they reach a certain age, or is that just a coincidence? I also wonder where or how the fungus gnats get indoors? I assume the mites could be in the soil but the gnats? I also don't notice any signs of pests (gnats or mites) other than actually seeing them critters (no webbing, etc...). You guys don't suspect the curly top virus at all?

How would you guys go about dis-infecting the area to prep for future garden?

And lastly, once a plant is infected is it doomed? Just call it a loss and cull it?

**James D.** · #6 October 10th, 2006, 08:55 PM

I use bleach, or chemprocide at work to dis-infect my work areas. Also you can sterilize your soil by placing it in the oven at about 350 degrees for half an hour or completely dry, just place in it a pan or roaster. If the plant is infected with a virus yes it is doomed and should be thrown out and not composted, the viruse can stay alive in the compost, and if it is infected with insects they cna be easliy eliminated.

Timberland · #7 October 11th, 2006, 06:28 AM

Thank you for all the help.....it's much appreciated!

I would think that placing soil in an oven or microwave would kill any nutrients. This isnt so?

One thing i did notice and failed to mention is that all this seems to happen only on new growth.....does that change any of your opinions? If it were mites wouldn't they attack the entire plant?

**James D.** · #8 October 11th, 2006, 08:52 AM

No placing the soil in the oven won't kill the nutrients since they are not alive, and most potting soil is sterilized before it is sold anyways. If it is just thenew growth it may also be thrips, they are tiny black insects that move very quickly and are rarely seen.